Pedal power update

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Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

Over the past few 15? years since I bought my multi-output power brick the world has changed. Sure, my little box only cost about £20 and had 8 x 9V outputs, but all outputs shared a common ground and a shared 9v regulator that took the 12V from the switch-mode wall wart and regulated it down. Multi-output power supplies like the T-Rex offerings cost an arm and a leg, and some reviews are still going on about them. Fender's Engine Room line seem to be in that premium price range, but to be honest they look more or less exactly like the Harley Benton ones.

http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton ... _1_pro.htm 8 x 9V outputs, each up to 500 mA to a total maximum of 2A £41. Sounds like a good replacement for my current brick but...
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http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton ... _5_pro.htm £41 This one has two switchable 9/12/18V outputs - and 18V would be good for my old flanger. But I could also do that with 2x 9V from the other box.
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Other output configurations...
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There are also cheaper not-fully isolated alternatives such as this Asmuse/Caline/Mosky on ebay and £29.99 at Amazon which also has 12V and 18V outs but not switchable like the Harley Bentons. Very tempted as I have Amazon vouchers to burn.
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A number of people are also now offering rechargeable battery-powered ones; this Joyo seems to be a hybrid.
http://www.thomann.de/gb/joyo_jp_05_po ... pply_5.htm £52
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(edit: Turns out the Caline/Asmuse isn't fully isolated.)
Last edited by NickS on Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by Bacchus »

I've been very happy with my MXR Iso-Brick. 10 outlets, two of them sweepable from 6v to 15v, two of them 18v. To be honest though, if there was a Harley Benton equivalent that was a third of the price, I probably would have bought that instead. Although I suppose the MXR takes up less real estate...
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Are they "properly" isolated? I remember there used to be a spate of cheap supplies that claimed to be isolated but weren't really. I realise that I'm asking this mostly in the vain hope that I haven't spaffed a load of money on the MXR when the HB cold do the same thing much cheaper!

A battery powered option sounds amazing. I wonder how usable they are, long term or would they end up useless after a year or two?

USB out is such a useful feature as well. Wonder if we'll see that become more common.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

I spoke to Thomann on the online chat and they assured me that the outputs are completely isolated, no common 0V/ground. You can get encapsulated PCB mounting isolated DC-DC converter modules for about £4 each retail so I imagine they're using something like that.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by ekwatts »

Yeah, pretty sure that £58 one is a rehoused version of the one I have. The base unit is, I think, originally released as a Palmer for about £80, then it popped up under a bunch of names on eBay for £30 or so, and I eventually got the Fame badged one from DV247.

There was a smaller model released years earlier where the 9v and 12v sections shared a common ground but were isolated from each other at least. I don't know if that's how mine is, and I haven't checked, but I also haven't had any issues with it so.... I dunno?

Amusingly, it looks like the Fame one is now the same price as the Thomann one:

http://www.dv247.com/en_GB/GBP/Fame-DC ... IgQAvD_BwE

This is the smaller one I had as a stopgap:

http://www.dv247.com/en_GB/GBP/Fame-DC ... 047652-000

The one thing I would say is, make sure you get one that has a UK plug for its own power supply. Finding an 18v 2000ma power supply to replace the EU/US plug was a fucking PAIN IN THE DICK.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by ekwatts »

In fact, looking at the first one I posted that is identical to the £58 Thomann one, the Fame one does actually say on it that the 9v connections are isolated from the A+B variable connections, so that would suggest a common ground, wouldn't it?

I have a multimeter somewhere but my pedalboard is currently in the corner of my room at my sisters under a whole load of packing since I need to move out soon, so I can't easily get to my stuff to check it for myself.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

ekwatts wrote: Fri Mar 04, 2022 2:55 pm In fact, looking at the first one I posted that is identical to the £58 Thomann one, the Fame one does actually say on it that the 9v connections are isolated from the A+B variable connections, so that would suggest a common ground, wouldn't it?

I have a multimeter somewhere but my pedalboard is currently in the corner of my room at my sisters under a whole load of packing since I need to move out soon, so I can't easily get to my stuff to check it for myself.
I'd be interested, when you can.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

ekwatts wrote: Fri Mar 04, 2022 2:55 pm In fact, looking at the first one I posted that is identical to the £58 Thomann one, the Fame one does actually say on it that the 9v connections are isolated from the A+B variable connections, so that would suggest a common ground, wouldn't it?
It certainly looks like it.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

I've ordered an Asmuse one out of interest.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

asmuse_power.jpg
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It arrived yesterday. It does solve reduces the issue with noise from the Digitech Drop, but it's got a common ground, at least on the 9V outputs. If I touch the centre of one power lead (ground) to the shaft of another (9V), the light goes out on the 9V port. This suggests to me that the polarity reversal cable would not actually help to drive a mix of positive and negative ground pedals. However, I don't have any positive ground pedals... I'm in two minds whether to return it or not. At £30 it is considerably cheaper than one of the Harley Benton fully isolated (?) ones and it reduces the number of adapters needed.
Last edited by NickS on Sat Mar 12, 2022 5:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by ekwatts »

I've used polarity reversal converters on daisy chains and they've worked fine?

If you need to mix and match anything that needs full isolation, you can still use the two independent outputs to do that if you need to.

The thing that I've wondered about some of these new cheaper power supplies is how the total MA draw claims printed on the units can sometimes be higher than the MA supplied by their bundled power supply adapters, but I suppose if the 9v sections aren't isolated that kind of explains it on some level.

I've been doing some deep digging and it really is difficult to find any supplies that DEFINITELY have individually isolated 9v outputs at this price point. Plus, it seems that there are really only a few specific models that are being rebadged to infinity by these cheaper companies. I know the fancier ones with the steel shells are mostly Palmer units, but the slimmer ones like the Asmuse one you got seem to be ten-a-penny, and I would be genuinely shocked if any of them had individually isolated 9v outs. I'm fairly sure I remember seeing both the familiar Palmer DC8 and another one in the same case that advertised the fact it had individual 9v isolation, but that was a few years back now and I can't find it anywhere. It was called the ISO8, and I know a company called Vitoos used to make and sell one on eBay, but looking now it seems to be gone. Even so, without ever having had one in my hands and tested it for myself, it's impossible to verify any claims of individual isolated outs because there's so much bullshit talked about this stuff... Cheapest I saw it in 2018 was somewhere around £40, so if that specific model is still floating around under a different badge, it's definitely more expensive than that now.

As an aside, Vitoos seems to still be around, turning out the same folded steel enclosure units, but now painted either white or yellow depending on their function.

http://www.aliexpress.com/premium/vito ... ext=vitoos

They look the part, at least, but even a quick scan suggests that none of them have individual 9v outs like you're looking for. And that's without mentioning the fact that even for a relatively unknown brand like Vitoos, these power supplies are still £50 at a minimum.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

I may just have to build a positive ground pedal to check out the polarity conversion.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by ekwatts »

Haha, yeah, it's really not something you want to get wrong. The only reverse polarity pedals I currently have are the POG and my Moogerfooger FreqBox, and I'm not taking any risks with them.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

Still got noise from the Digitech if I use a high-gain pedal (fuzz face clone or similar).
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

The 12V died on the Asmuse PSU, so I decided to do a tear-down.
asmuse_psu_int-1.jpg
asmuse_psu_int-1.jpg (181.69 KiB) Viewed 2154 times
You can see there's an input filter and three toroidal inductors, one for 5V, one for 9V and one for 12V.
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The "isolation" amounts to individual self-resetting fuses and filtering for each output.
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This is why the 12V isn't working:
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You can see from the underside that there has been some rework on one of the outputs and that the inductor for the 12V wasn't properly soldered in the first place.
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So I guess I'll return this for a refund and look out for something better.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by dots »

the the Asmuse indicate it was used? or is it just that faulty?
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

dots wrote: Mon Mar 14, 2022 7:25 pm the the Asmuse indicate it was used? or is it just that faulty?
No, brand new. Poor manufacturing quality, that dry joint, and anyone with some common sense would have used hot melt glue to stabilise those inductors, especially on something that's intended to operate in a gigging environment. Aluminium case gives the impression it's solidly built, but it's just window dressing.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by ekwatts »

And from what I can see online, that case setup is all over the place right now, probably with exactly the same level of quality control.

Sometimes it feels like a golden age for gear, but the proliferation of all this stuff means you still have to go digging for the real gems. Whereas in ye olde days you'd have the choice of a cheapo wall-wart or a pro-level Voodoo Labs, now you have 50 different companies selling basically the same products with minor variations to set them apart. But, really, the amount of choice you actually have depends on whatever design the Chinese factory has on hand.
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Re: Pedal power update

Post by NickS »

The frustrating thing is that the design isn't bad for what it is, but it's been let down by sloppy production.
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