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is the sound of the Strat in the cheapness of its parts?
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 12:59 am    Post subject: is the sound of the Strat in the cheapness of its parts? Reply with quote

You may have noticed I'm on a bit of a Stratocaster tip at the moment so... I was in Glasgow today and played quite a few Strats and S type guitars and it flung up this question. I played a fender select, a Tyler, one beginning with an A that I can't remember the name and lots of 0s on the price tag and the most Straty sounding Strat of the day was the Squier cv 60s Strat. So as the price rises the materials allegedly get better but the guitars sound less like they're supposed to... What say you, am I talking shite or have you had the same thought?
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Freddy V-C
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's something in this idea, for sure. My favourite Strat I've ever played is still my ex-bandmate's Squier Affinity.

I should really convince him to sell me that...
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't imagine Leo used the highest grade rolled steal or brass available for the originals, alot of his decisions seemed to be made on a balance of cost v function as anything I've read has said he used whatever wood he could get his hands on. So these high end variations must be quite far from the original beasties...
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aen
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think tit for tat Squier has been making the best strats for a good 4 years or so.
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Rox
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Light cheaper resonant wood, thin paint and a bolt on neck? There's truth to that.
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had no intention of buying anything, I was just wasting time while me wife got her hair done. The fender select was horrible (bloody thing went out of tune if you even looked at the trem) I can honestly say the Squier was a far nicer guitar my el cheapo V6 is a more enjoyable guitar to play...
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speedfish
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have an American Deluxe Ash with N3's that has that ultimate bright sparkly strat quack. Surprising because the PU's are noise cancelling and a lot of players complain that they aren't straty enough. I also have a MIM 60th anniv with TexMex PU's and it also sounds bright and quacky. Sadly my other strats are kinda meh by comparison.
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rox wrote:
Light cheaper resonant wood, thin paint and a bolt on neck? There's truth to that.


I was thinking more in the way of hardware, trem block materials and saddles, my current Strat has a definite 70s feel to the weight (i.e it's a heavy beastie) but still has that spank n sparkle you expect
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jcyphe
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The sound of the strat is its design.
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jcyphe wrote:
The sound of the strat is its design.


But the cheap and the expensive ones were designed the same only the "quality" of the parts differed.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dezb1 wrote:
jcyphe wrote:
The sound of the strat is its design.


But the cheap and the expensive ones were designed the same only the "quality" of the parts differed.


I don't know what you played and can't explain what you feel.

Also a lot of modern strat makers change things like the neck heel, number of frets, type of vibrato, type of tuners.
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singlepup
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Squier CV 60s Strat is also my favorite Strat in recent memory. Somehow it just feels and sounds great.
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jcyphe wrote:
dezb1 wrote:
jcyphe wrote:
The sound of the strat is its design.


But the cheap and the expensive ones were designed the same only the "quality" of the parts differed.



a lot of modern strat makers change things like the neck heel, number of frets, type of vibrato, type of tuners.


That's my point even fender have changed stuff from the original design 6 point Vs 2 point trems, solid saddles Vs bent steel, noiseless pickups, brass trem blocks locking tunners, but it still says Stratocaster on the headstock... All allegedly upgraded but do these higher quality replacements take the guitar further away from what people loved in the first place?
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes I think so.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fender make all the Strats with all the bridges. It would be sort of an empty gesture to give brownie points to Squier for doing a "Classic Vibe" Strat that sounds Stratty while disparaging Fender for their 2015 "Select Stratocaster" doing something different, even as unimpressed as I am with such Strat ventures. There's always the MIM Classic and AVRI lines (which do full-on '60s reissues with the proper necks and potentiometer value and all) holding down the OG swag, and I've yet to play a Squier I enjoy as much as either of those due to the contemporary radius (how's that for an upgrade).

If it's trying to be a classic Strat and it doesn't sound Stratty, odds are it's a front for drug trafficking or Scientology or something, just put it down and wash your hands.
This is the Fender you played:

Quote:
Its modern “C” shaped flame maple neck has a comfortable contoured heel, Bi-Flex™ truss rod system for rock-solid stability, a satin lacquer back finish and rear-headstock “Fender Select” medallion. The smooth-playing compound radius flame maple fretboard (9.5”-14”) has 22 medium jumbo frets, stylish black pearloid position inlays and gloss lacquer finish. Pure and singing signature sound comes from new Fender Select Stratocaster single-coil neck, middle and bridge pickups with five-way switching and a no-load tone control that delivers the natural uncolored sound of the bridge pickup when dimed.


I can tell just from reading that it's not trying to be a classic Strat but some blueslawyer shit.
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wasn't saying fender don't make a good Strat any more, more that the constant striving for exclusivity seems to be getting further away from the original idea. I also played a mim Strat which was setup so badly I don't know how good the guitar might have actually sounded... This wasn't a props to Squire thread, more a thought on the 50s/60s fenders that are now hallowed instruments being made to a cost and being very basic, as opposed to some modern versions with all the bells and whistles that sound a bit dull and lifeless.
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speedfish
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dezb1 wrote:
I wasn't saying fender don't make a good Strat any more, more that the constant striving for exclusivity seems to be getting further away from the original idea. I also played a mim Strat which was setup so badly I don't know how good the guitar might have actually sounded... This wasn't a props to Squire thread, more a thought on the 50s/60s fenders that are now hallowed instruments being made to a cost and being very basic, as opposed to some modern versions with all the bells and whistles that sound a bit dull and lifeless.


I've always wondered if the 50's and 60's strats actually sound better than todays offerings, but I've never had the liberty of playing them. Unfortunately the quality control and craftsmanship went to shit in the 70's after Fender was purchased by CBS, so guitarist started pining for the good old days and the value on those 50-60's strats skyrocketed as a result. I can't see paying $30,000.00 for a strat, but that's the price some are willing to pay to hold a piece of history in their hands. I tend to lean toward less expensive guitars too, it's strange, but I usually appreciate the feel and sound of these instruments better. My American has spent most of it's existence in it's case. I have often wondered if it's a character flaw in some of us or are we just more open minded to the idea that an inexpensive instrument can sound as good or better than an expensive one?
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

speedfish wrote:
dezb1 wrote:
I wasn't saying fender don't make a good Strat any more, more that the constant striving for exclusivity seems to be getting further away from the original idea. I also played a mim Strat which was setup so badly I don't know how good the guitar might have actually sounded... This wasn't a props to Squire thread, more a thought on the 50s/60s fenders that are now hallowed instruments being made to a cost and being very basic, as opposed to some modern versions with all the bells and whistles that sound a bit dull and lifeless.


I've always wondered if the 50's and 60's strats actually sound better than todays offerings, but I've never had the liberty of playing them. Unfortunately the quality control and craftsmanship went to shit in the 70's after Fender was purchased by CBS, so guitarist started pining for the good old days and the value on those 50-60's strats skyrocketed as a result. I can't see paying $30,000.00 for a strat, but that's the price some are willing to pay to hold a piece of history in their hands. I tend to lean toward less expensive guitars too, it's strange, but I usually appreciate the feel and sound of these instruments better. My American has spent most of it's existence in it's case. I have often wondered if it's a character flaw in some of us or are we just more open minded to the idea that an inexpensive instrument can sound as good or better than an expensive one?


Character flaw indeed, I have this built-in need to keep stuff good - the more expensive a guitar is the more I'll baby it and therefore not enjoy it fully. Where as with an £80 pre banged up guitar I'm not so precious. I've realised I'm better of buying B stock for this reason if I get a mint guitar it'll stay mint at the cost of just enjoying playing it and not giving a fuck... I've always wondered about how good a 50s/60s guitar really is they must've had their fair share of lemons too... But nobody who just paid £30,000 for a guitar is going to publicly humiliate them selves buy saying the guitar I shite.


But the perception of how good the good ones are what we blindly base our scale on...
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Progrockabuse
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love strats!!!!
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dezb1
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Progrockabuse wrote:
I love strats!!!!


No shit, when are you getting the green one?
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