ShortScale Forum Index www.shortscale.org
Head 'n Neck Above
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
UploaderUploader   ShortScale WikiBuilder

are Jags Teles for the aging guitarist?
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ShortScale Forum Index -> Short Scales
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Josh
The Curmudgeon


Joined: 17 Nov 2008
Posts: 4599
Location: George

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 1:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the reason that they didn't sell in the late 60's and 70s was SUSTAIN. Les pauls, teles, strats, etc all have mad sustain, all are string through or had a stoptail bridge. in the 70s everyone wanted chords that rung forever through giant Marshall stacks. that's why people were putting humbuckers in strats (EVH), the Tele deluxe was made, and there were so many les Paul knockoffs in the 70s.

in the 70s no one wanted plunky ass fenders with mad treble and no sustain like we do today. everyone wanted to sound like led zeppelin, t rex, the stones. and plunky fenders didn't cut it. today we all have such diverse tastes in music that these guitars are popular again and work with our respective styles of music. thx Internet.

back then almost everyone liked what we call classic rock, and it was all about sustain. and jags/jazzes weren't as solid so they didn't last.

there's nothing wrong with these guitars or how they play. they just weren't in style at the time. in the 60s there was a lot of plunky clean guitar, surf music, the dawn of fuzz and overdrive, reverb. all stuff we love and appreciate now but was kinda forgotten about in the 70s during those 10 min guitar solos. this is why Kim fowler made sure that the nuggets boxed set was created (LISTEN TO THIS, LEARN YR HISTORY).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
dezb1
The Oppressor


Joined: 01 Mar 2009
Posts: 7371
Location: glasgow

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The arthritic fingers was a joke... But the oldies are claiming the jag for their pension tours.
_________________
Extreme distortion used discreetly...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
BearBoy
.
.


Joined: 30 Aug 2011
Posts: 5207
Location: Location: Location

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:22 am    Post subject: Re: are Jags Teles for the aging guitarist? Reply with quote

Rox wrote:
Surfers in the 60s played Jags because hey couldn't afford a Strat or Tele


Eh? Jaguars were Fender's top of the line guitar in the 1960s and cost more than Strats or Teles. No-one would have been playing one because they couldn't afford a Strat.
_________________
Fran wrote:
I love how this place is basic as fuck.

ekwatts wrote:
I'm just going to smash it in with a hammer and hope it works. Tone is all in the fingers anyway.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
benecol
Best Poster 2010


Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 6971
Location: Westcountry

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So much bad wisdom about guitars in this thread. It's like someone shone a signal at the sky "n00bs assemble".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dezb1
The Oppressor


Joined: 01 Mar 2009
Posts: 7371
Location: glasgow

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

benecol wrote:
So much bad wisdom about guitars in this thread. It's like someone shone a signal at the sky "n00bs assemble".



Aye... the ministry of misinformation.
_________________
Extreme distortion used discreetly...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
NickD
.
.


Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 3711
Location: Sheffield, Innit

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dezb1 wrote:
benecol wrote:
So much bad wisdom about guitars in this thread. It's like someone shone a signal at the sky "n00bs assemble".



Aye... the ministry of misinformation.


Yup.

Anyone who remembers buying guitars in the late 80s and early 90s in the UK knows that you didn't buy Jags/Jazzmasters/Mustanges et al because you couldn't - there just weren't any around.

The first Jazzmaster I ever saw in person was the one I used in one of my teenage bands. And even then our bassist (who owned it) had gone to London to find it.

It wasn't all that cheap either - 500 for a new MIJ iirc when my Epi Les Paul Standard was about 300
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NickS
.
.


Joined: 14 Jan 2008
Posts: 9459
Location: Nr. Basinggrad, UK

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 12:09 pm    Post subject: Re: are Jags Teles for the aging guitarist? Reply with quote

BearBoy wrote:
Rox wrote:
Surfers in the 60s played Jags because hey couldn't afford a Strat or Tele


Eh? Jaguars were Fender's top of the line guitar in the 1960s and cost more than Strats or Teles. No-one would have been playing one because they couldn't afford a Strat.


Indeedy. Here's a '68 price list I found on line:
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
BearBoy
.
.


Joined: 30 Aug 2011
Posts: 5207
Location: Location: Location

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting that sunburst was the cheaper finish in those days. Is that because all painted finishes were custom jobs?
_________________
Fran wrote:
I love how this place is basic as fuck.

ekwatts wrote:
I'm just going to smash it in with a hammer and hope it works. Tone is all in the fingers anyway.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dezb1
The Oppressor


Joined: 01 Mar 2009
Posts: 7371
Location: glasgow

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To this day no one I've been in a band with has owned a jag or a jazzmaster...
_________________
Extreme distortion used discreetly...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
71Smallbox
.
.


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 2242
Location: Brooklyn

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dezb1 wrote:
To this day no one I've been in a band with has owned a jag or a jazzmaster...

I've been in 2.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
benecol
Best Poster 2010


Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 6971
Location: Westcountry

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You should have introduced yourself: "Hello Dez, I post on shortscale too! Do you remember me from your last band?".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
71Smallbox
.
.


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 2242
Location: Brooklyn

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FWIW, Will Sergeant has had a Jaguar since at least '86, so he was hardly considered old then. This thread is pointless or I am just an old fuck who happens to prefer a Jaguar.

Oh, hello Dez, I post on shortscale too, do you remember me from your last band? I was the geezer who played the sunburst Jag albiet very poorly. That was probably due to the copious amounts of Buckfast I consumed!!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Noisy Cat
.
.


Joined: 25 Aug 2011
Posts: 594
Location: London

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

paul_ wrote:
Of course, now a bunch of kids in complicated shoes have ruined them.

This wins ShortScale.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rox
.
.


Joined: 13 Apr 2010
Posts: 1283

PostPosted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 11:54 pm    Post subject: Re: are Jags Teles for the aging guitarist? Reply with quote

BearBoy wrote:
Rox wrote:
Surfers in the 60s played Jags because hey couldn't afford a Strat or Tele


Eh? Jaguars were Fender's top of the line guitar in the 1960s and cost more than Strats or Teles. No-one would have been playing one because they couldn't afford a Strat.


Jags and Jazzmasters were considered their " Flagships " but just because they are " Flagships " doesn't mean they were good sellers ... Talk to Volkswagen and see how the Phaeton worked for them.. Or the Edsel for Ford .. Rolling Eyes Flagship by balls .... Razz
Come the 70s and 80s a Jag and in a lot of cases Jazzmasters ( btw Jazzmasters were always considered " the flagship" despite price) could be had for cheap.. Trends ...
90s grunge brought on the offset revival..
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
superfuzz
.
.


Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 1829
Location: Detroit, Mich.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 1:30 am    Post subject: Re: are Jags Teles for the aging guitarist? Reply with quote

Rox wrote:
BearBoy wrote:
Rox wrote:
Surfers in the 60s played Jags because hey couldn't afford a Strat or Tele


Eh? Jaguars were Fender's top of the line guitar in the 1960s and cost more than Strats or Teles. No-one would have been playing one because they couldn't afford a Strat.


Jags and Jazzmasters were considered their " Flagships " but just because they are " Flagships " doesn't mean they were good sellers ... Talk to Volkswagen and see how the Phaeton worked for them.. Or the Edsel for Ford .. Rolling Eyes Flagship by balls .... Razz
Come the 70s and 80s a Jag and in a lot of cases Jazzmasters ( btw Jazzmasters were always considered " the flagship" despite price) could be had for cheap.. Trends ...
90s grunge brought on the offset revival..


Dude, I'm not trying to be harsh but c'mon. The Edsel wasn't a flagship for FoMoCo, it was to compete in the spaces between Ford, Mercury and Lincoln. It was a brand that was designed to compete with Olds, Desoto, Pontiac and Buick. It truly failed because of the 1958 recession, and the whole vagina grille (I'd argue more in regards to the split bumper but I just don't like split bumpers). The FoMoCo flagship has been Continental, which is technically a subsidiary of the Lincoln Motor Company, but feh. And the MKII Lincoln is arguably the best car that ford ever built, and it lost like a grand on each one that they sold. That is the definition of a mass production flagship.

The Jaguar was its flagship, and it was also a hot seller. Fender never lost money on the jaguar. You're right in a sense that the jazzmaster was the "flagship" as it was everything new for 1958 (strange how that takes place during a recession and flops too innit?). Then, it sat around for a couple of years not getting a whole lot of jazz attraction, but was a popular rock and roll guitar. Then surf, then the jaguar became the number one fender.

ALSO, by 1960, the stratocaster was 6 years old. Picking up a second hand stratocaster would be VERY doable. Much cheaper than plopping down nearly 400 bucks on a surf machine.

No one is arguing that the now famous alt rockers of the 80s and 90s didn't spark a revival, I'm just trying to say you need to go back through your fender history and give it a second look. In comparing sales numbers.
_________________
My Instagram
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
71Smallbox
.
.


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 2242
Location: Brooklyn

PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rox, I think alot of people here would be less critical of what you say if you simply dropped that awful sig. I don't even read your posts anymore because I don't want to look at it. Also Rox, Have you ever seen a picture of the Beach Boys in the 60's? Google it. They weren't poor either.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
honeyiscool
.
.


Joined: 01 Feb 2011
Posts: 2072
Location: San Diego, California

PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 8:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WayToHip wrote:
taylornutt wrote:
Perhaps in their older age they realize their is more than just strats and teles and embrace something new.
Uh, boom?!
Maybe they are looking for a new sound too. The Marr jag has the seriies/paralell switching. Tons of sonic options.
He did get that idea from Tele modders, though. They had the 4-way Tele switch way before it was ever put on a Jaguar.
_________________
Kicking and squealing Gucci little piggy.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
torchindy
.
.


Joined: 27 Mar 2014
Posts: 102

PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I saw my dad this past weekend and I was showing him the Jag, which he was pretty excited over. Said he hadn't seen one in years. He was saying that when he was in high school in Seattle in the mid 60s, Jaguars were the hottest shit you could buy, holy grail guitars, and all the coolest kids had them and were playing surf. Then Hendrix came home from the UK and played a show in Tacoma using his bought-for-cheap-because-somebody-traded-it-in-for-a-jag Stratocaster, and everything changed.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
paul_
.
.


Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 9091

PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 3:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BearBoy wrote:
Interesting that sunburst was the cheaper finish in those days. Is that because all painted finishes were custom jobs?


I don't know why for '68, but certainly in the pre-CBS era deviating from the "standard" finish (butterscotch '50s Teles, white blonde early '60s Teles, sunburst Strats or Jags) was a custom order and added cost because it wasn't done to any certain number of them at a time. The Teles and Jags also got different pickguards when they were solid colours (except the oly white Jag). A lot of "Custom Color" Strats from the early '60s were even factory refins sprayed over an existing sunburst finish... so the sunburst strats and jags were the ones that were always good to go out the door, whereas ordering a custom model at the wrong time of the year could result in a painted-over sunburst body, perhaps.

SRV's '62 Fiesta Strat and a Custom Shop Relic that references this:
Hidden: 



_________________
Aug wrote:
which one of you bastards sent me an ebay question asking if you can get teh kurdtz with that 64 mustang? Mad

robertOG wrote:
fran & paul are some of the original gangstas of the JS days when you'd have to say "phuck"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Fran
The Curmudgeon


Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Posts: 21038
Location: Nottingham, Englandshire.

PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 6:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It seems to me the Jaguars popularity happens periodicly, usually with the same kind of players in or around the tag 'alternative'. It was inevitable that Marr would use them at some point.
Will Sergeant predictably used them in the 80's, not often but there is definitely some footage somewhere.

It is now a legacy design of course, repackaged, with its Surf connections long forgotten.
The reason it was reborn and became popular the first time, we must have discussed a thousand times.

Interesting to hear it is becomming popular in Country Music though, yet another twist in its history.
_________________
dezb1 wrote:
Stop fucking about and get an SD-1

robroe wrote:
I got a stomach ache. Anyone got any heroin? Or like a gun or something?

brandonwinmill wrote:
Maybe i'll sell my internet. It's lost its fun since i already beat it twice.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    ShortScale Forum Index -> Short Scales All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 2 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

Anti Bot Question MOD - phpBB MOD against Spam Bots
Blocked registrations / posts: 622491 / 0

Guitars at Musician's Friend

Help support this site by clicking the above link!